When Interviews Don’t Provide Good Quotes, What Do You Do?
Thanks so much to Helen Mann for this awesome question!
When you're interviewing sources for a story, it's critical to ask the right questions and really probe them for top-notch information. But, even despite your best efforts, some interviews don't bear any quality quote fruit. What do you do now?
This week's livestream is going over how to get amazing interview quotes, what to do if your interview doesn't provide good quotes and how often this happens, how to ask good follow up questions, what to do with your final article for submission, and how to notify your source of any changes with the story.
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When Interviews Don’t Provide Good Quotes, What Do You Do?
So, what do you do when you've done an interview, whether that's for a magazine or a business client, a reported article, or some kind of report that you're doing for a client, what do you do when you don't get good quotes? Um, this is something that happens often. It happens all the time. So first thing I'm just gonna tell you is like, don't sweat it, this, this happens.
And there's a few things that we can do to fix it. So we're gonna go over those things today about what to do and how often this happens. And I have the original question, uh, it was submitted by Helen Mann. So thank you, Helen. And we're going over basically how we're gonna put all these things together, like how we're gonna deal with, um, you know, our, um, our interviewee, like how we're dealing with them, their quotes, follow ups, all that good stuff.
So I have a bunch of notes and I have a bunch of things that we're gonna go over. Um, and I think this is really important just in like, as you're kind of going along in life. To be able to have your confidence in asking really good questions and then knowing what to do, if even if you're doing great questions and great follow up and all this stuff, if you're not getting good information, so we're gonna go through all that stuff today.
So the first thing that we're gonna talk about, and I have my notes here, just to make sure that we have everything going, where it's supposed to be. So hold on, let me make sure these are gonna pull up. I actually have several packets of notes. for this. All right, here we go. Okay, so let's talk about this first.
1) How to get amazing interview quotes
So number one. Hey Vicky. Welcome. It's timely. Vicky, are you doing an interview soon? um, so let's talk about this. So the first thing that we're gonna talk about is really how to get interview quotes, like how to get really amazing quotes from your interviewees and how to kind of put all this good stuff together.
So. The first thing is you have to ask really, really good questions. So this means you're not asking yes or no questions. You're asking a lot of, uh, open ended, very specific questions that your audience cares about. Vicky says I'm about to conduct an interview. Any tips on preparing the interviewee and PR contact.
Yes. We're gonna get to that. Uh, we are going to, um, talk about that later on. So don't worry, Vicky. I've got you. so when we're asking questions, they should be specific to what the audience needs to know to take the next step. They should be specific to what the audience has to know in order to understand the topic.
And they have to be things that like aren't. uh, basic questions like, well, how would you do this? Like you have to say, like, what are your top five steps to do ABC? Or what are your top this? Or what's like, the question that I always ask is what's the most important thing that our readers or our audience, or you name the target audience, right?
You say property managers, what's the most important thing property managers need to know about X. That is how I lead off the interview. A lot of times after you ask for their name and confirm their, like their location and all that stuff, the first thing I always ask is what's the most important thing.
Blah, blah, blah, whoever the audience is, needs to know about topic, whatever the topic is. Uh, and that usually helps them kind of grease the wheels and get going and give, um, a really good interview because it gets them thinking about all the things that could be important. So that kind of helps with your further questions.
The other thing that you wanna do to get good quotes is organize your questions. So not only do you need to have really specific questions, you know, like steps or, um, what are pros and cons or things like, um, I always like take apart the pitch. So whatever was the pitch, whether I pitched it or it's like the idea that someone gave me or the content brief, I take it apart and to figure out like, what questions would I need to ask to get this inform?
Like what types of things am I curious about or interested in to help me as the reader of this, understand this topic, those are your questions. And I like somewhere between 10 and 15 questions, like pretty much all the time. And some of those questions include like, what's your name and where you do live and can I record this and then like, what's the most important thing about this?
The other ones are like, is there anything else, uh, that you wanted to mention or anything that you thought I'd ask about that I didn't. And then I always ask like, uh, if I have any other questions, can I, oh, we gotta Digger. Uh, can I follow up after? So that's four questions right there. So I always like to have like 10 to 15 questions per interview, uh, depending on how it goes, case studies, different question.
If I'm doing a case study, that's gonna have like a like 50 questions. um, hold on. You need to go under the blanket. Hold on, let me help you. There you go. There you go. All right now we're happy cuz we're all under the blanket. So that's kind of your range, but you wanna make sure they're very specific questions and as you're kind of going through this ask follow up questions.
So even if your questions are your, can you go back to your HOA hole? You were so comfy go back to your HOA hole. Good girl. Um, so Minnie, I just got, I got everybody settled. Um, even if you're asking really great questions, you need to make sure that if someone says something interesting that you follow up with a question about that, like how did you, uh, like, well, can you tell me more about that?
Walk me through ABC or I always like to do that. Like if someone's on like a thought in their mind and they end and I'm like, wait a minute, I wanna hear more about that. Like, can you tell me more about X, Y, Z, walk me through the steps or walk me through, um, how someone would do that or walk me through how blah, blah, blah audience would do this thing or how they would think about it or what kind of shift they would need to.
So you need to be smart about follow up questions too, while you're doing the interview, because they're in that frame of mind, they're like thinking about all this stuff together and you have to make sure that you're kind of like, uh, as you type. So I always take typed notes. I know that a lot of people are like, zoom is gonna be fine.
No, sometimes things fail. I've had it like I'm knocking on wood right now, but I have had all my recording things fail sometimes. Like, that's just what happens. So I always take type notes as a backup, as I'm typing and I'm listening, I'm thinking about what they're saying. And then I'm like, oh wait, we should talk about this.
Or we should ask, I should ask a question about that. There's all these different pieces that are really important to follow up on. And this is another way to get good quotes. Not only are you asking them very specific questions that have honed in answers. Um, you're also saying like, hold on a minute, you're on a good train of thought.
Let's talk about that thing more and then asking a follow up question. So, um, something that I think a lot of freelance writers and journalists need to work on is that is like your follow up questionability because sometimes you start with some questions and then you're like, oh wait, you know, this isn't, these aren't the right questions.
Now that I'm kind of listening to their answers, this isn't the right thing. Then you kind of realize like, hold on, we've got follow up questions we can answer. So we wanna make sure that we ask those while we have them on the call. We can always ask them later. Right. We always ask them at the end of the interview, Hey, do you mind if I follow up with any questions?
They almost always say yes. I mean, I, it would be pretty rare that they would say no , um, but you know, you wanna catch them while they're in that good mental head space. Hal says very timely. I have a zoom interview with a magazine in my niche next Tuesday. Thanks Mandy. You're welcome, Hal. You're welcome.
And Vicky says, yep. I recorded two softwares and type notes. Yep. That's what I did with my phone. So when I did phone interviews, I would record on tape a call pro and I would record on, um, rev call recorder. So I would always have it, but now I just do 'em on zoom, cuz it's easier. And I don't have to get my, give out my phone number um, but you know, it always, something can always happen.
Tech is always messed up. So what you wanna do is make sure you take type notes. So as you're kind of going through this, right, you wanna make sure that you're asking those specific questions you're asking follow up and the third thing here to get amazing quotes. You actually have to listen. there's a lot of times I know I'm laughing, but like there's a lot of times where writers come to me and they're like, well, I don't know what they said.
I'm like, were you actually listening? Like, were you having a conversation with them? That's all a good interview. A good interview should be basically like a conversation where you're like, oh my gosh. Um, how that was so interesting. Like how did you even get there? Like how did you come up with that? Or, man, I've never heard of that before.
Like, did you get an idea from someplace? Like it needs to be? I always think about it that way. Like, I am conversing with someone through an interview. I'm not just asking a question, sitting there, silently waiting till they stop. And then asking another question. I'm like making comments sometimes. So like I'll mute myself while I'm typing.
Right? So like, I'll ask a question, I'll mute myself and type. And then if they say something funny and they laugh, I will laugh with them. Or I'll say like, oh my gosh, I totally get it. Like, I will encourage them to keep talking. I will. Um, like, and these are genuine. I'm not like fake laughing um, but like a lot of times when you hear someone laugh, you wanna laugh with them.
Or when you hear someone say something interesting, you wanna do that too. Right? Like you wanna be like, oh my gosh, that is interesting. Like, let's talk about that. Um, so you should think about it as a conversation where you're like pulling information out of them through having a conversation. And I feel like that's how I get my best stuff is like, I'm just sitting there asking them questions.
Um, that's really, really important is it should be like a conversation. And as you go through, um, your interviews, like I've done, gosh, I've done thousands of interviews now. um, but as you kind of go through your interviews, you get better and better at asking questions, you get better and better at understanding what you need to follow up on and what kind of information you need.
And you get better at having that conversation with them as they answer questions. So don't worry if you're just starting out, if this is like really it's, you know, it's, it's not that hard, like, just think about specific questions. Remember these are specific questions. And the other thing I think is important.
In our first thing that we're talking about here is I have, like, I used to be, um, pretty shy about it, but I am a fantastic question, asker. Like that's one of my special scales. I'm not fast. I'm not, , I'm not a fast writer, but I am really good at asking questions. And I'm really good at asking follow up questions and listening to like the little, like, they're almost like jingle bells where you're like, wait a minute, hold on.
That's really important to this article. Let's ask about that. That's something that's really. Hey, Carol. Welcome in. I hear you. Woo. Can you lay down, lay down. Woo. Lay down. Woo. I hear you. I hear you making noise. Woo. So, um, I think that that's really important is like, look at your skills. Like, are you a really good question, asker and most journalists go back to your Haba hole.
most journalists and most people who are writers are really good at asking questions. So hone into that skill, hone into that ability. And pay attention to that. That was something where I'd be like, oh, you know, I'm not that good. You know, I'm not, uh, man, I wish I had more experience here. Go be, um, I would, I would like disparage myself a lot of the time, but then I learned through looking at like my own questions, my own work and looking at other people's questions that I was really good at that.
So if you're really good at that, that's a very special scale. That's like not a lot of people are like, um, if you ever read the four tendencies, um, by, um, Ellen Rubin. So the four tendencies by Ellen Rubin, I'm a questioner. That's like, there's four of 'em. I'm a questioner. It's like one of my natural things.
I'm I'm. I ask a lot of questions all the time. You can ask anyone who spends time with me, I'm always like, what about this? And how about that? so if you're good at that, that means you should be able to get good quotes. And if you're working on that, definitely keep working on that skill. It's a really important skill to have, as you're like moving through your writing career, whether that's, uh, reported articles for magazines, or you're doing case studies in white papers, or you're doing target audience interviews, or, um, like brand personas or stuff like that.
Like knowing how to interview and knowing how to get those questions, right? That's how you get good quotes. And then you listen, you actually have to listen and follow up with them. this is really important. Cuz some people are just like so busy typing that they forget to actually listen to the information.
So you have to listen and pick up on those little like twinkles of like, oh wait a minute. That's really important for this topic. So know your topic, ask the right questions. Those are really important things. That's the first thing that was number one that we're gonna talk about. The number two thing we're gonna talk about, and we're gonna do a pub date because, so I'll put two up.
2) What to do if your interview doesn’t provide good quotes and how often does this happen?
We're gonna do a pub date. So we have our friend . So underneath, underneath the gray blanket is Barry. I don't know if he can hear us right now, but it's good for him to sleep. Charlotte, can you go to your ha hole, go to your ha hole, go to your, have a whole, do you have a whole good girl? So let's do a quick update here.
Go B hi five. Hi five. So here's the deal underneath that blanket? is Barry. So the last time we haven't seen Barry in a while because he has been dealing with a really serious issue that we thought we might have to make a tough choice about him, um, because he's 16 and he can't really have surgery. It's just really hard on him.
He had some really intense pain meds and it just, it was too much. So, um, so he, um, he has been healing. and he is now basically like he's a miracle dog. he has, we have avoided surgery. We've avoided all other medical things. Uh, so now basically he just has one more specialist appointment to follow up on.
And, uh, other than that, like we put, you know, we give him some goop and do some stuff and, um, he's just been doing great. Like I can't, we just can't believe it. He's basically like regenerating, like his, his, his eyes have never looked better. Um, and we also learned that like, if he did have to have surgery, you know, the eye surgery is like really intensive, so, you know, it's a whole thing.
So, um, it's yeah, we're really, really happy that he's feeling better. He's sleeping right now, just cuz like he's old, but um, just as everybody just as like a P date for everybody Bo is doing much better. He's about to turn 16 soon. Um, his, his eye is. Like, you know, shortly, like we have one more appointment in a month and hopefully by then it'll be fully healed, but he's feeling a lot better.
He's back to being a spicy Tamali and I thought I would have him up here just, you know, cuz before he wasn't feeling great, but now he's being like a spicy tuna, but now he's sleeping. Um, so everything has been going much better. It's been basically like we didn't expect it to go this well, like, so we're really lucky.
Um, and he's, I don't know. He's just kind of every time like something happens, he somehow just regenerates, like he just becomes better than he was before. So, um, he's he's doing great. Thank you for everybody who sent me all the notes and the kind words it has been really stressful for like the last, like, I don't know, six weeks or eight weeks.
However, I think it's six weeks, but um, now I think we're, we're kind of in the good zone. So Charlie, Charlie over here, give me a lick. Thanks. Uh, Charlie still smells like skunk. We are working on it. What happened is now we found that when it rains, which it hasn't rained all summer here in Austin, but when it rains and Charlotte goes outside and gets wet, she just makes our whole house smell like skunk still.
So the skunk is still in her skin. We're gonna give her yet another bath. It's like her 10th. It's like her billionth bath. Hopefully it will be gone by then, but that's what's going on with the pop dates. So hopefully, maybe we'll see Barry pop out afterwards. Um, but let's get back to our topic here. So number two is we are talking about what to do.
If our interview doesn't provide good quote quotes and how often this happens. So I'm gonna start with how often this happens. And if you feel like this has been helpful so far, give it a thumbs up. If you feel like you wanna learn more about how to, you know, do journalistic style articles or how to build a hiring freelance writing business subscribe.
So here's the deal, how often this happens, it happens more often than you think . So a lot of times I get people that are like, oh no, I had one interview. It didn't go well. And I'm like, This happens like you, sometimes you get someone where it's their very first interview. They don't really understand the topic.
They're just trying to get press or like something else happens where you're just like, Ooh, this is not good. So this happens, like it happens more often than like you think it's probably like 10% of interviews. I would say, like, I would say out of the thousands of interviews, I've done maybe like a handful, not even 10%, like the interviews I've done, it's probably been like five or maybe 10 out of the thousands that I've done where I was like, Ugh, this isn't gonna work.
Um, but it's really rare. But like I said, like one of my special skills is that I'm really good at asking questions and following up and getting information. So if you find yourself at kind of like the 10% rate, that's totally normal. If you find that, like you keep doing interviews and they keep turning out poorly, you really gotta look at your questions.
You okay. You really gotta look at your questions and you really gotta look at, like, if you understand the topic and how you're doing follow ups, so don't freak out. This happens, you will do an interview and you'll think it's great. And then you get off the phone and you're like, oh shit, this is trash time.
so this is where we ask follow up questions via email. That's why, when you're on the call with someone you say, can I follow up via email with questions? And then they say, yes, and now you can. So if you realize that things have gone awry, you can always follow up with email questions. Now there's other things to do.
Right? So, um, when we're kind of going through our interview things with, um, good quotes, I want you to remember that there's a couple things that happen here, and I'm gonna walk you through them. So I wrote them down. Hey Marie, welcome in. I, I wrote them. So number one. Okay. When you find out that the person isn't right for your story, that's different than not getting good quotes.
Okay. So if you don't get good quotes, follow up via email, do as much as you can to figure that shit out. Okay. And this is really important to credibility and to helping your editor, if you turn in shitty quotes to your editor, your editor's not gonna wanna work with you anymore. Like that's a big problem.
They they'll give you grace and leeway, of course, but you, you gotta figure that out. So for me, okay, whenever you find out like you do this interview and then you realize, oh shit, this person's not a fit for this article. Okay. That's the first scenario you do the interview and you're like, you get off the call and you're like, oh no, this person's not gonna work like this isn't gonna work.
So what you do is you email them immediately and you say like, Hey, it turns out. You know, uh, this, this isn't quite the right fit for the article, but I'd love to save your quotes to use for another piece. That's the first one. The second one is if you're like, this is just garbage time. I can't use any of this.
Try to get some follow up questions and get something useful. The other part of that is, um, oh, you okay? You okay? Hi. Are you okay under there? You're all right. You scared me with a sneeze a little bit. Barry. Hold on. You. Okay. Over there, Barry. hold on buddy. I'm coming to help you. Bless you. Bless you. How you doing?
You wanna join the, join the team. Here you go. Yes. Here's your support duck here. He is everybody. He's got his support duck. He's doing all right. He's feeling okay. He's covered with a blanket. He's been sleeping a bunch and also running around a bunch. Like he shouldn't be, but can't control a spicy tuna.
You go, oh, there you go. All right. There he is. Char go back to your ha hole.
So hopefully everybody will chill now. So there you go. All right, Barry, you get one more, cuz we can't give you too many trios. It's too. It's too hard on your system. Can you, uh, you're not gonna be able to catch it. Here you go. Good job buddy. All right, so let's go back to this. So you email them immediately and you say follow up questions.
The other thing is to email them immediately and just tell them straight up like, Hey, this is not gonna work for the piece. Uh, I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much for this thing. And I would love to reach out for another story that I feel like is a better fit for you. You have to let them know immediately.
If you get off the call and you have to let them know immediately, like. This is not gonna work out because you don't want them expecting press and then seeing the article and then being like, why wasn't I quoted where's my stuff. Like what happened, notify them immediately. The other thing to remember here is that you can also stop them during the call.
So this is all like I was telling you, I'll post call. This is when you're on the call and I've done this, let's say, um, let's say let's pick a random person. How so Hal and I are on an interview. And I tell Hal is like, let me tell you about this farm equipment. And I'm like, uhoh, you know, we're on the wrong thing.
And I'm like, all right, let me redirect you with a different question. How, and then how's like, let me tell you about ag tech. And I'm like, Ooh, how we're not on the right topic. And then I redirect him again or ask him another question. And I. Hal is not the right fit for this piece. Sorry, Hal . Um, but I go and tell him like, Hey, um, Hal, let me stop you right there.
I realize that I don't think you're actually the quite right fit for this piece, but I would love to reach out to you if I have another piece that I feel like is a better fit for you. I know that the information you're giving is great. I really love the stuff you're saying, but it's not quite on track for this scope of this piece.
So is it okay if we end the interview and I reach out for something else that I feel like is a better fit that you can always do? And I've done that because you're like um, yeah, our house does smell much better now than skunk. Hi, go. Um, so you can always stop the interview and just like, you don't wanna waste their time.
People are giving you their time for free, right? I mean, you're giving them press, but they're giving you their time for free to answer your questions, to help with your article. And if you realize you're wasting their time. Stop. Like if you realize that this is not a fit, their interview is not a fit.
Just stop them. Tell them what I just said. Like, I appreciate your time. I, I love the information you're giving, but it's just not within the scope of this article. And then you put them on a list. I do this all the time. Like I have something where I'm like, oh yeah, I should reach out to Hal if like, when I have another piece about this, so I can include him back in for something that's a better fit.
You don't also want people to have quotes in an article where it's obvious that they're not on topic. The whole point of people getting press and ending up with articles that, um, they can share in their community or share that they're like a thought leader or that they're doing whatever is that they look good, right?
Like their quotes look good. They look smart. They look like they know what they're talking about. And you don't wanna be in a position where you're putting someone where they look bad. Like we're not using quotes. Like you're not combing quotes and saying like, I'm only using their best stuff. You're combining quotes for the stuff that looks the best in the article.
But when you do that, you get the best stuff. So then when they see it, they're like this article is amazing and my quotes are amazing. Right? So that's all important stuff here. Go, buddy. There you go. Good job. Um, so all of that stuff said, it's okay to stop people. Don't waste their time. Make sure you put them on a list so that you're like, I should reach back out when I have a piece that's a better, that makes more sense.
Um, and then you can Al you know, always apologize, right? Like, say like, Hey, I'm so sorry. You know, this didn't work out, but I know, you know, like you, you're giving me a ton of super smart information and I love it. It's just not quite the right fit. I would love to put you in this, you know, if you have another article you're working on, you're like, Hey, let's do, um, I've done this before.
I've started interviewing someone for one article and I'm like, wait a minute, you're talking a lot about this other article I have. Can I interview you that for that instead? And they're like, uh, sure. So I scrap all those questions. I pull my questions from my other article and I interview them for that instead.
So they still get an interview. It's just for a different piece. So the deal here is that you, you wanna make sure that you're respectful of, of people's time. You're getting the right quotes and information. You're putting them in the right place. Like, um, you're putting them in the right article, but you're also like making sure that the article and the content and your audience are like number one.
So if you're not getting the right information, Cut it off. The other thing is that, um, you wanna be honest about the frame of which so be honest of like, Hey this, I don't think this is gonna make it in. Um, or you can tell them like, Hey, uh, here you go. You can tell them like, Hey, um, I think it would like always be honest with them about where the quotes might end up or if it's not gonna work or if your editor cut it.
Because sometimes what ends up happening is you turn in an article and an editor cut some of your stuff, which ends up cutting all of their quotes. And then you can say, Hey, I'm so sorry. You know, my original draft did have your quotes, but it turned out that when it went to publication, they were short on space.
We had to cut it, like always be honest about what's kind of going on in the process because that's how you, you know, keep respect as a journalist. You don't want to lie to people and then have to like backtrack or do other stuff. You wanna be honest with them about the process and whether or not they're gonna be included and how things are going.
Um, and then you can give them kind of like an explanation about like, what's going on. You don't wanna get to the point where the piece is published and they're like, why am I not included what's happening? Like always keep your sources up to date because those sources kind of pay dividends over time.
Right? Like when you find a really good source, they keep giving you great quotes. All the, I keep I've used the same sources a bunch of times, because I know if I go to, if I go to, uh, to Vicky or if I go to Marie or if I go to, um, let's see if I go to Hal or if I go to Carol or anybody else, I know I'm gonna get good quotes from them.
Right. So then I make sure that I have these quote, like they know the, the deal, they know, like I'm always honest with them. So they're like, yeah, you always give it to me straight. Like I don't ever have to worry about, I already know, like, is it gonna make it or not? So always keep them in the loop and be honest.
Um, the other thing is that, that I wanna talk about is three. So let's talk about three here. And if you have questions, you can always put 'em in the chat. Um, we have questions submitted today too. So I have a couple questions, but if you have a question that you want me to answer on the live stream, you can always go to Mandy ellis.com/question.
3) How to ask good follow up questions, what to do with your final article for submission, and how to notify your sources of story changes
Uh, you can put in a topic or a question. We have a couple submitted today, so I'm gonna pop in those later, but that's your option? So three. So when you're kind of going through this thing, like after you've asked the follow up questions, and you've said like this isn't gonna work, um, what you wanna make sure that you do is, um, that you, um, you can always save and interview.
Okay. So this is something that's important. If I interview someone for X magazine and I realize they're not a fit, but a few months later, I end up with another article where I'm like, oh, that interview I did was a really great fit for this. You can save that. Okay. So you can say like, okay, the interview wasn't for this, you can use quotes in another article.
So if you didn't use that interview, In that article. Right? So like I, so we have article a and interview B, right? If it doesn't work for article a, I can use it for article C and still use interview B. Right? So this is important. A lot of people think that if they're just interviewing someone for one article, they're like, oh no, it didn't work.
uh, scrap everything. No, no. You can use those quotes in another article. Like if you didn't use them, I don't like to use one interview for like multiple articles. I don't like doing that. You can do that. Um, but I like to say like, if this interview isn't working here, like save the material, save the interview, right.
The, the transcript. Um, and see if there's something else that comes up. That's happened for me before, where I'm like, okay, uh, here we go. This isn't working for, for article a, that's a huge bummer. I'm gonna hang on to this and see if there's anything else. That's a. Then a few months later, I'm like, oh, sweet.
I got this article. I know, um, that, you know, so, and so would be really great for this. All I have to do is email them and say, Hey, remember that interview. We did, I would love to use those quotes for this article. What do you think? And they're like, sure, sounds great. You know, now I've so like now I've kind of like salvaged this interview and salvaged, you know, the chance of them getting press and doing all this cool stuff and helping with the article, all that stuff.
So don't just toss it. Um, just because you go, just because it didn't work out the first time now there is a limit, like there's a limit on how long you can keep interviews, um, and pertinent information. So like if you do an interview, um, just be careful about how long you, you keep that transcript and how long you kind of keep stuff.
I just, like, I feel like a year is too long. So like six months I feel like is, is kind of a good range. And like, if you don't end up with another article where you can use that. Material. Like you can always reach back out and say like, Hey, so, and so, uh, remember we did that interview. It didn't work out, but I have another piece that I'd love to interview for and you do a second interview with them, but that stuff is all really important to know.
Okay. That's all really important. It's like you don't have to scrap something just cuz it didn't work the first time, but have a time limit on it. All right. Notes in here. I wanna make sure I go over. Um, do do do. Okay. I think those are all those notes. Okay. Different notes now. All right. So when you're kind of going over this information, okay.
Marie says, what if you interview someone and they had some quotes that you used in an article, but didn't use all the quotes. Can you use in a different art, different quotes in a different article? This is what I was just talking about. Yes, you can do that. You cannot repeat quotes. So if I. Four quotes from their interview in article a, I can't go use those quotes in article B.
Like once you use the quotes, it's over, yes. You can interview someone and, and use other quotes on their interview for other pieces. I just don't like to do that. Um, I like to just call it like one and done because the topics are different. And I like to ask different questions. Like, uh, a lot of times the scope of one article that seems similar to the scope of another is actually very different and you would wanna know different information and ask different questions.
So I don't personally like to do it, but other people do it all the time. They like do one interview and they use it for four articles. They just use different quotes out of it. That's just not what I do. I don't like it. so, uh, that's just me, but yes, as long as you don't repeat quotes between different stories, as long as you are using fresh quotes, um, from someone, then that's fine.
You also wanna make sure that you have variety. You don't wanna have like. This is something that I find where it's kind of like a slippery slope. Like if you have one source that you've quoted in your last four stories, like it doesn't look that great. It makes it seem like you're not very good at calling information or finding different types of people to interview.
Like, I think the variety of different types of people you can talk to is just so vast. Right. So if you keep kind of using one person, like you're only really getting one frame of mind, one mindset, one kind of like life scope. I that's another reason I like to use different people for each article because I'm looking for a different point of view.
I'm looking for different types of people, um, over time. And yeah, I have used some people, but a lot of times what ends up happening is I have someone that I use once a year and I just use them once a year. So like, that is fine. Uh, but do be careful about, he will be here. Here we go, buddy. Do be careful that you don't repeat any quotes and that you are, um, cautious about, uh, using those quotes in a different article that you notify them too.
You can't just like use it. You need to ask them like, Hey, I know I put your quotes in article a, is it okay if I put them in article B? Um, because sometimes they're like, Ugh, I don't really feel comfortable being in that magazine or being in that thing. So you have to notify them each time. That's really important.
Uh, it's still not my favorite thing though. just to be honest. All right. Let's talk about this. Let's talk about, um, when you have your final article submission. So let's talk about that. Actually. Let's put that as four. I think that makes more sense to, or did I just put three up? I don't remember. We'll just put it in three.
So three . So here's what we're gonna do. So nothing from your sources perspective should be a surprise. Okay. Nothing from your sources perspective should be a surprise. That means. You are clear through every step. So when the article goes to publication, they should either be confident that they're gonna be in there or know ahead of time that they're not gonna be in there, which is what, you know, something I've already said, but it's, it bears repeating.
Always be honest with them. Hey, I cut your quotes. Hey, I like this wasn't working. I wanna use you for another piece. Um, you know, if it goes to publication and your editor ends up cutting it, which happens all the time, just go to your source and be like, Hey, I turned it in, in the original version. It turns out that, uh, it got cut for space or it got cut.
You know, my editor makes final decision on all quotes. Um, I'm so sorry, but I would love to keep you in mind for other pieces. Like there should be nothing. That's a surprise that you can control. You can't control how much space is there, or if they wanted to change the magazine a little bit and add an add or something that your editor's like, Hey, we need to cut 200 words.
You can't control anything your editor does, or the choices that they make on your article, but you can control all the parts of the process that you're involved in, which is being upfront and honest with your sources. So when the piece comes out, there should be no surprises for your source that you could have controlled.
So that's something to always remember, that's really important. Um, and then you need to notify them, right? So like, let's say you read the article and you realize that source is not included, notify them. Like, let's say the source, didn't email you or say like, Hey, why, why wasn't I included send them an email and say, Hey, here's the link to the article, but I just wanna let you know that, uh, what ended up happening was your quotes got cut.
I'm so sorry. I would love to keep you in mind. Right. But always keep them like updated on stuff. You go bear. That's really, really important to journalistic integrity. And it's really important to having like this nice, honest connection. And to me, um, what also helps with getting good quotes is being, having this like more raw relationship where you're like, Hey man, I'm doing my best.
Here's this information, right? It's not, um, It's not like you're like being super secret journalist and you're like hide all the information from the sources. Like it's not like the movies, , it's not like the movies. The more you kind of build these, these more honest relationships, the better information that you get, um, for your stories and for your articles and for your case studies or whatever, those honest relationships and being upfront with people that really matters because publications come and go, clients come and go, but those sources are around.
They're around all the time. So you wanna make sure you're upfront with them as much as you can be and that you get back to them and let them know what happens. That's really, really critical. All right, let's talk about, I think that's kind of it, um, that I wanted to mention, but yeah, when you're kind of going over anything.
hold on when you're kind of going over anything where you're just worried that your interview didn't provide good quotes or there's something, you know, just work on your skills. Okay. Number one is always work on your skills question, asking skills, question, writing skills, topic, understanding skills, uh, follow up question skills, work on those, because that usually solves the problem.
A lot of times I end up, um, with students or freelance writers that are like, Hey, why didn't this work out? And I look at their questions and their questions are like, just kindergarten. Like it's really basic. You can't get good quotes with basic questions. You need very specific, detailed questions in order for them to give you good information and you need to listen to their interview so you can ask good follow up questions.
And if all else fails and everything gets, you know, messed up, go back and say, ask them, follow up questions via email and say like, what's happening. What's going on? Um, you know, like here's some questions. Can you answer these? And then you can kind of salvage the interview. And if that doesn't work, let them know it's getting cut or it's not a fit and you move on.
Okay. That's the best we can do. Um, but yeah, like there's, this is a normal thing. It happens, uh, it doesn't happen super often, but it does happen and we can only do the best we can do. So if, if it does end up on the cutting room floor, that's part of, I hear you will go back to your HOA hole. My hand smells like skunk from touching you , um, that's kind of just like, you know, the cutting room floor is part of the editing process.
You can't control that, but you can control, um, other parts like notifying them or asking questions or, or doing anything you can to kind of salvage that interview to include it. All right. Ready? Take a good job, buddy. You look great. You look great with your support duck. I love how you look with your support.
So Bo used to be a dog that would destroy everything, like anything that was fluffy or stuffed with something, he would destroy it. But we've taught him now that this is his support duct, and this is his support duct that's, uh, a pillow. So he doesn't destroy it because now he knows it's a pillow and not a play P so we've gone many years now with the support deck.
So that's been a big step. Good job, buddy. You look great. I know your, your vision's still a little off. You're trying your best. You go, buddy. Good job. All right. Gimme your high fives. High five high, five other one other one. Good job. Good job. Skunk mistress. She's our skunk mistress. Um, let's see. Okay. We have questions too.
That we're gonna go. From people who submitted them. Marie says, what did Marie say? Um, in the wealth lab I learned to ask better questions. It's made a huge difference. Thanks. Oh yes. So, um, that's something we do go over in freelance writer, wealth lab, which is my course is like, I walk you through how to do that.
I walk you through how to ask better questions. I walk you through my actual article writing process. Like I walk you through the whole thing, like how I actually go from, um, getting all the questions set up and the garbage draft to like final finished product. I give you a whole video lesson on that. Um, but yeah, I walk all of my students through like, here's how to actually get these good quotes.
Here's how to actually get information that people are like, wow, I can't believe this. Like, this is such a good quote or so much good information. I walk you through that process. Um, also freelance writer, wealth lab is gonna open up in like a little over two weeks. Like I think it's two weeks from Tuesday.
If I. Is that the calendar. So yeah, two weeks from this coming Tuesday, freelance writer wealth lab is opening up. I know people have asked me that. So nine, six, so September 6th, um, if you go to mandy.com/course, you can sign up for the wait list for it, but it's opening up on September 6th for enrollment for the fall.
Uh, it only opens twice a year, so it opens in September and April. So if you don't join the fall class, the next time that you would get the opportunity is basically like late April early may. So if you go to mandela.com/course, you can join the wait list for that. All right. Let's get to questions. So we have some good questions today.
All right. Question guest posting for those who have little to no clips, is it worth it? How to get it done most effectively? My opinion is it's not worth it. so I would not be telling you how to do it most effectively. Well, no, I, I will, but, um, it's just not worth it. Like guest posting is a lot of times for like, when they want someone to come in and do thought leadership, like guest posting has changed a lot over the years.
Guest posting is a lot different than it was five years ago. A lot of times now guest posting just means like, we know that you're a name in this industry and we want you to put a post on our, um, on our blog or on whatever. So for me, it's better to just get paid for your work. So what that means is I would pitch out ideas.
That's how you get clips. So if you're worried about sending Lois letters of introduction to businesses, and you're like, oh my gosh, no, one's gonna accept me. If I don't have clips, here's the deal go. Pitch magazines, pitch, online magazines, trade magazines, all the things, pitch them ideas because ideas become articles.
Rather than saying, like, here's this guest post now, I guess sometimes they will call it a guest post, but you're better off pitching ideas to get clips. And you only need one. Okay, don't forget this. You only need one clip to move along. So whether that's one clip total or one clip in a new niche or one clip, whatever you need one.
So if I was gonna move into a new niche, I would need one clip to do that. If I was gonna move into freelance writing, I would need one clip to say, here's my clip. This is what I got right now. And the best way to do that is to pitch out ideas because your ideas, um, have a better chance of being accepted than like a guest post, which just your, the guest post is often on a place where it's not as, um, as well known as getting in something like a trade magazine or an like a site.
There's always places that are looking for pitches. So. I would go do that. I would go look through media bistro or I would go look through, um, there's like a jillion newsletters, like, um, pitch whiz is now what's it called? Um, covered press. So pitch whiz has a whole bunch, or now it's called covered press.
So covered press has a whole bunch of calls. Hey, we want pitches on this. We we're looking for someone to write about that. We we're, here's our pay. Like it's just a, an, a never ending stream of information about editors looking for stories. I would go join, covered press or some kind of thing like that.
And it's free, covered press is free, um, or join a newsletter that says here's all the jobs or all the places. Um, like I have a friend, um, Amber, so I'm gonna mention Amber Petty mm-hmm . So if you go to Amber Petty and you join her newsletter, she is constantly, um, sharing jobs and writing opportunities and article opportunities in her newsletter.
Um, so she's always offering up stuff. There's just a billion of them. That's way better getting paid for your work and having a clip from a better place than guest posting. That's way more worth it. If you really want a guest post, you would have to go do kind of a similar process. You'd have to pitch out ideas and stuff, but that's, I just feel like it's better to have, there's just a wealth of opportunities to get a clip in a lot of places that are like really shiny names.
That's better than doing a guest post. Hold on a second. I have to cough.
Marie says the wealth lab rocks I've made so much more money. Yeah. Marie's Marie's always in here H up the wealth lab, cuz Marie has not only made more money, but she's working less hours. We're not working weekends. And she actually gets to take vacation, which is a big deal. Oh no baby sized. Okay. Hold on.
We're gonna make this regular sized if I can. Let's see. Um, I think this was the one I messed up last time because I know I'm putting in a weird place. How do I make it bigger? All right. We're just gonna deal with the baby sized question and I'm gonna do my best. So here's our baby sized question. all right.
I wanted to ask your opinion on whether or not participating in LinkedIn groups is worth it. Thoughts? Yes. Lots of thoughts. This is something we go over in the wealth lab. I tell you exactly what to do. Yes. Participating in LinkedIn groups. I hear you. Woo. I hear you. Woo. I hear you. I hear you. Um, participating in LinkedIn groups is definitely 100% worth it.
Now it depends on which groups they are. You wanna join active groups where people are sharing things, commenting on things, cheering people on positive groups. Uh, like I said, I go over this a lot in detail in the wealth lab. Um, Barry, I don't know if you're gonna be able to catch this. Barry. You wanna try this?
I don't know if I wanna throw it. Can I softball pitch it? Can you catch it close enough? It's right below you, buddy. see it. We see it. I see it on camera. You got it. Good job, Charlotte, go back to your ha hole. Charlotte, go to your ha hole. Good job. High five high five high five high five. Good girl. Good job.
All right. So LinkedIn groups are worth it, but you have to join the right groups and they have to be active groups and you don't wanna go into the groups and, um, just like spam everybody or say like, please get, take my services. The whole point of LinkedIn groups is that you're growing your network and warm leads and you're becoming a source of information.
So the point of LinkedIn groups is like, if you're the type of person who's really good at going into some place and being like sharing a lot of articles, helpful information, answering people's questions, LinkedIn groups are a really great way to get clients because then they're like, Hey, I've noticed that you're really active in this group.
Um, I love what you've been saying. Do you offer content services or I saw that you're a freelance writer. Let's talk about this. That's more of a fit. Um, LinkedIn groups are not for like, they're not Facebook groups where you're like, Hey, let me bar my service all over you. Uh, that's not what this is.
LinkedIn groups are more for like, you need to be a helpful resource first and you need to be part of the group first for a while, before anybody talks to you about services or before you can talk about services or say like in my profession, I do this, um, they are worth it, but it's a long term strategy and you have to be the type of person who's willing to put in many months of, um, building relationships in there before it kind of pans out.
All right. Hopefully this other one is not a baby size question. That one, I think I missed up last time. Okay. So, um, pricing question. So I'm gonna read the whole question. This is just an excerpt of it. Um, hold on one second. Let me pull it up. So the full question is, oops, hold on. all right.
Question: I had a question regarding pricing. I live in India and my clients are often in India, but they have offices in the us as technology companies often do I work with B2B tech companies. So this current client I'm working with, I'm undercharging them a lot.
I onboarded them when I was in a desperate need to get clients. And so I charged a low rate and now my contract is due for renewal in September, and I wanna increase my rates. I'm doing four blog posts at a thousand words, each and one white paper at 1500 words, which is more like a long blog post. And my monthly retainer is $700 a month. I grossly undercharged given that we're both in India, I have charged more before and have been working, uh, for four years in the industry and now have a rich portfolio.
Um, they received seed funding of 17 million this year. This, uh, scope of work has not changed though. They recently onboarded a thought leader as their head of marketing and AI. And that person really loves what I've been writing. How do I frame a rate hike to make sure that they give it to me?
So there's a lot of complex things in here that I wanna talk about.
And I think this is a really, um, a really fantastic question. So let's talk about this. Um, my hands are sticky from all those tree does. So the first thing is I think, so I know a bunch of writers who live in India who make six figures, who like, you know, so I don't think the, like when she says that she charged based on where she lives in India, I, I think you should charge, you know, what you think you, your work is worth going forward.
So now you have a rich portfolio, you have a bunch of things you've done. I think you should charge higher moving forward. So there's that the other thing is that, um, with them getting funding, that's super cool, but they use funding in different ways. So they might use funding for marketing, which means that they're, they would have a bigger content budget, or they might use that funding for something else.
Like you can't control what they use the funding for. So, yes, 17 million is a bunch of money and that's really great, but it also depends on how they use that money. Sorry. Cuz sometimes what happens is they use that money for building out a product. They don't use that money for content and it really kind of depends on how they're doing it.
I definitely think you should charge more for your retainer. So you're right on the right track there where, um, you feel like you should do that and a good time to raise your rates is when you have a contract renewal. So like when your contract renew, you could either erase your rates or not depending on how you wanna go at it.
So I'm gonna talk about that in a second. Um, but yeah, like all of these things, like it's great that the new person, the new marketing person loves your work. It's great that they got. Um, but the caveat here is that you don't frame a rate hike to make sure that you get it. There is no way to do that. That doesn't exist.
You can't control what other people do. Okay. So that's number one, no matter what you say or do, or how you say it, or, or how many marketing massages, salesy things you can't control, what other people are gonna do. There's just nothing. There's nothing to be done. So even, right, like even companies that spend billions of dollars on marketing and sales and like learning all the best tactics, they lose sales every single day, every single second, because you can't control what people are gonna do with their time and money and what they're gonna, you know, how they parse things out ready, buddy.
So close, but it's right near you. I didn't actually mean for you to catch it. I just meant to throw it near you. So that's the first thing is you can't frame anything to control what they do. So that's the first part. The second part, did you get it, buddy? There we go. You got it. All right. So the second part of that is when you increase your rates, that you have to be ready to walk away.
So this is something that's really important. This is an integrity thing. You can't go to your client and say, I'm gonna raise my rates to X. Like let's say, so your retainer, your monthly retainer is 700 bucks. Let's say you go to them and you say, um, I'm gonna change that to a thousand dollars a month.
And they say, that's not gonna work with our budget. So you have to walk away. Now you can't just be like, oh wait, wait, wait. I want the work. Let's stay at 700. That's not gonna work. Like, that's a big integrity problem. Like people that do that. Now, if you ever really did wanna do a rate raise, they know that you're not actually gonna do it.
And that it was like a sales tactic. You can't do that. So the deal here is that if you do decide to have your rate raise, so if you do increase your price, They number one may not give it to you. And number two, you have to be ready to walk away. So if you really need that work and you really need that money, the, the deal is that, uh, you either have to stay at that rate or you have to replace them and then walk away from that client.
So you can't just have this situation where you're like, I want them to give me this rate raise, like they're they may not give it to you. Like it may not be in their budget or they just don't want to. Um, and we have to stay in our integrity. Like if we say we're gonna do something with our clients, we have to do it.
Like there's no, there's no like weird thing where you're like, well now what do I negotiate? No, like you said, I'm raising my rate to a thousand dollars or whatever. The number is just picked a random one. You're like I'm raising it to a thousand dollars or like, Hey, uh, our contract is up for renewal, uh, based on, you know, the experience of working with you, uh, gaining more knowledge and you know, the success of the content.
Uh, I feel like this is a more fair rate. Does that work for you? And if they say no, then you have to walk away from. So that's the thing is when you're in these situations, you have to decide like, do I wanna keep this 700 a dollar a month retainer? Do I need it? Uh, can I find other work at better rates?
How's my financial situation. Um, but you're always kind of going in there with the idea that like, if you raise prices on a current client that they may say no, and then you have to walk away. So look at your whole financial thing, like, look at all of your finances, look at how your work is coming in.
Look at like what you think. Like, can you trade that client out? Can you do a bunch of marketing and, uh, hopefully get a client that will pay more? Um, do you like, do you have a bunch of other work where you're like, eh, if I lose 700 bucks a month, like yeah, that's annoying, but it wouldn't, you know, crash my financial situation.
Uh, you have to look at all that first before you ever go and do the rate. Now what I do when I do that type of stuff, like I already know if I send that email that I would have to walk away if they say no, like you can't just say like, no, no, no, 700. Like you can't do that. Um, so if I send that email, I usually send, say something like, you know, um, Hey, we've been working together for six months.
I know that we're, our contract is up for a renewal. Um, I feel like with the work that we've done, that you've really loved and all this stuff, um, you know, just explain to them what you've done and how you've helped. And if you have any results, share those and then say like, I'm thinking that it might make sense to change our, uh, our agreement from 700 to a thousand.
Does that work for you? That's how I do it is like, does this work for you? And this is why I'm think. The other way that you can do it is you can say like, Hey, I've already raised rates for my other clients. And I would like to keep us on par because of X, Y, Z. Right. Which is like, because we've been working together and the content has been successful or you've gotten 50% more leads or whatever it is.
Does that work for you to switch from 700 to a thousand or whatever it is, what you're doing is asking them like, is this gonna work? And a lot of times like people do rate raises and people are like, yep, that sounds good. You know, cuz their budget has changed or they love working with you. Um, so there's a lot of ways where yeah, it can work out, but there's nothing like there there's always a holding point where like they would have to agree to the new rate you like.
I just, I it's really important to me to stress to you. Like you cannot make someone give you anything, no human on the planet. You can't make any human on the planet. Give you something, if they don't want to, like, that's not how it works. Um, and the other thing is that there's a lot of ways to frame it based on results that you've gotten.
So if you have results or you have a great relationship or, um, someone really loves your content or it's performing really well, those are all things that would, uh, validate a rate hike. The deal is that, you know, you have to figure out financially if keeping this client is a, is a good idea. Um, if it, if the losing $700 would be a big problem for you, if you're ready to walk away.
Um, but your integrity is something you can't get back. Like once you start making choices about how you run your business, your Bri, your business is, um, like your, your business rests on like it's. It's kind of like this idea where the there's like waves washing over a rock, right? So like, if you start eroding your integrity by being like, oh, now I'll do this.
Or now I was faking you out with this rate hike or I was doing like, that's a big, like, you become this very small pebble and that's a big problem. I hear you. Woo. Can you go back to your H hole? Thanks. Um, but yeah, so you can also say, so Tommy says, I would just say that you're raising your rates without explaining everything and ask if it works for them.
You can do that too. um, but that's usually a different thing. So you're usually doing that when you're doing an annual or, or bi-annual rate raise. So when you just say like, Hey, my rates are now this does that work for you? That's usually when it's across the board, you're like ready to do an annual or bi-annual rate raise when you're doing things per contract.
Like this person is when you're like, my contract is up for renewal. Uh, that's a different time when, like you've already worked with them and built a relationship and it's a lot easier to get. Um, it's a lot easier to get a rate raise. When you say, like, you've validated that with a bunch of points with the relationship that you've built, if you're just raising rates across the board and saying like, does that work for you a as your BI, like your, you know, every six month rate raise or your annual rate raise, that's a lot easier to just say like, here's my new set of prices.
Does that work for you? And they say yes or no. And you cut who doesn't fit because you're doing a rate raise and that how that's, how it works. So it really depends. I always feel like if you have a relationship with someone, it's easier to say like, Hey man, I've done all this cool stuff. And I feel like we work really well together.
Um, you know, like I feel like as we're up for renewal, this new price makes sense for the value that we have together. You know, does that work for you rather than doing something like you would for a typical rate raise across the board where you'd just be like, here's my new thing. Like our new retainer would I'm raising my rates.
Um, our new retainer would be a thousand bucks a month. Does that work for you in moving on with your life? So this is a common question. So I, this is a common question I get it's totally normal, but like I said, you can't get your integrity back. You have to be ready to walk away. Um, and rate raises are normal, but like I said, with current clients and your bi-annual and annual rate raises, like it's different ways to approach it, but you, you have to be ready to walk away so you can't force them to give it to you.
All right. So I hope that was helpful. Um, let's see. I think those are all the things that I wanted to make sure we went over today. Let's do one last pop date and then we'll hop off. All right. Barry. Barry, you look so cute with your little duck pillow, Barry. I can't believe that you're like a bionic dog.
You're just like regenerate. I can't believe like how good you look right now after all the stuff you've been through, you're still like, you're still looking good. Back up. Go back to your HOA hole. You boss being go back to your HOA hole. No, you gotta go back to your HOA hole. Go back to your HOA hole.
Good job. High five gentle high five high five gentle. Ah, you're scratching me. Gentle. Calm, your calm, your paw high five. This one, this one. I see you drooling, but I want this one. There we go. Good job. You look like good job, Barry. You look so Regal. You look like a Regal beagle over there with your little duck pillow in your blanky.
All right. So I hope that this was helpful. I hope that it made you feel less stressed out about quotes and interviews, um, and learning how to, um, get, you know, ask good specific questions and what to do. If you're like, my interview was garbage. What do I do? Um, I hope that this was helpful with that. Uh, Vicky says thanks for all the things.
You're welcome, Vicky. . You're welcome. Um, so if you guys ever have questions, like I just answered, or you want me to go over a different topic, go to mans.com/question and pop in. Like I said, last reminder, uh, for today, at least, um, the course freelance writer wealth lab, my course is opening up in about two weeks from Tuesday.
So on nine six on September 6th, if you're interested in that and you wanna hear more about it, go to mandy.com/course and sign up for the wait list. Uh, the furs are gonna be here hanging out. Um, but I really appreciate everybody chilling and this was a great topic. So thank you, Helen, for the topic. And, um, I will see you guys next week.
We're here every Friday at noon central time. And, uh, yeah, I hope this was fun. I will see you guys next week. Bye.
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